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Re: martial law

Postby ghost123 » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:42 am

Sorry for your loss. Hope your father recovers from this horrible virus.
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Re: martial law

Postby Jetcrafter » Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:25 am

Yes, sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine how you’re feeling and what your going through. Sorry. I hope your dad gets better quick. I also have major dittos to the comments regarding considering others, while still wanting to do things we love and feel normal. I don’t want to get others sick.

The asymptomatic aspect of this sucker is the scary part to me. Wish we had more testing with a quicker result turn around.
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Re: martial law

Postby lovetheedge » Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:15 am

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Re: martial law

Postby mtncntrykid » Fri Apr 03, 2020 1:58 pm

Thank you all for the condolences.They are appreciated.

Food for thought -

"When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves."
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Re: martial law

Postby Akclassic » Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:22 pm

"When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves."

This is called giving up to me. To others, it's called settling. And to the last group it's called taking orders.
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Re: martial law

Postby Hell Yes » Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:34 pm

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Re: martial law

Postby JettinAK » Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:27 pm

Have any of my fellow Alaskans seen the news concerning spring bear hunts? Apparently the state feels we are threatened by the virus while hunting,.... alone,.... in the middle of nowhere. I am not a bear hunter but seriously, how far off the rails are they taking us. I fully understand shutting things down in the cities and I would go as far as accepting closing the campgrounds but to close hunting, that's a little to far for me. I bet they will try restricting fishing too. Places like the Russian river and Kenai during dipnetting are a madhouse.

UPDATE: I should have kept reading, apparently there was enough pushback, the state rescinded the no hunting order.
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Re: martial law

Postby Akclassic » Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:38 pm

JettinAK wrote:Have any of my fellow Alaskans seen the news concerning spring bear hunts? Apparently the state feels we are threatened by the virus while hunting,.... alone,.... in the middle of nowhere. I am not a bear hunter but seriously, how far off the rails are they taking us. I fully understand shutting things down in the cities and I would go as far as accepting closing the campgrounds but to close hunting, that's a little to far for me. I bet they will try restricting fishing too. Places like the Russian river and Kenai during dipnetting are a madhouse.

UPDATE: I should have kept reading, apparently there was enough pushback, the state rescinded the no hunting order.


There have been lots of rumors, but they're just that. There is too much cultural significance to many of those activities. I can see if it got real bad everything but subsistence getting closed.
I dont see our governor doing that though.
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Re: martial law

Postby Jetcrafter » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:36 pm

Akclassic wrote:"When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves."

This is called giving up to me. To others, it's called settling. And to the last group it's called taking orders.


Really - AKclassic? - I understand what you're saying, I get it, born and raised up there, but not everyone is a tough independent Alaskan.

BUT I get what Mntcntry is saying also. My take is, Mntcntry's post is regarding dealing with a personal situation - you're's is directed toward the larger political situation. The dude just lost his Mom! Those moments make me consider life's curve balls and what I actually can control. I can control me (most of the time ;) ) and my reaction to a problem.

I think it's not cool to take his quote and use it to make a political point.

I'm not saying this is you specifically, but there's plenty of folks out there that say stuff online they wouldn't day say to another dude face to face.

There's already been another argument between two well known members today on another thread. Lets just be nice and get through this mess.

:chicken: :Drink:
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Re: martial law

Postby mtncntrykid » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:32 pm

We are in the throws of a worldwide pandemic crisis with no confirmed means to control. There are guidelines being put in place by leaders, at suggestion of scientific experts. People have no means to control this situation and the only way they can contribute to help themselves and others in the world is to unselfishly change their way of life by following these guidelines as closely as possible to prevent suffering or death to themselves and others.
Personally, I don't consider this giving up but a far stronger human being than the one who considers only his own wants and needs.

Jetcrafter,
Thank You for seeing the true meaning in my posts!

I have said my peace and will dis-continue this conversation in respect of the other members on this great site.
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Re: martial law

Postby JettinAK » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:12 pm

It's not rumors, as it stands now only residents will be allowed to hunt. Governor will be releasing restrictions on fishing soon, I am told on the 11th. Sounds like it will be open but pretty tight restrictions.
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Re: martial law

Postby Akclassic » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:54 pm

Jetcrafter wrote:
Akclassic wrote:"When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves."

This is called giving up to me. To others, it's called settling. And to the last group it's called taking orders.


Really - AKclassic? - I understand what you're saying, I get it, born and raised up there, but not everyone is a tough independent Alaskan.

BUT I get what Mntcntry is saying also. My take is, Mntcntry's post is regarding dealing with a personal situation - you're's is directed toward the larger political situation. The dude just lost his Mom! Those moments make me consider life's curve balls and what I actually can control. I can control me (most of the time ;) ) and my reaction to a problem.

I think it's not cool to take his quote and use it to make a political point.

I'm not saying this is you specifically, but there's plenty of folks out there that say stuff online they wouldn't day say to another dude face to face.

There's already been another argument between two well known members today on another thread. Lets just be nice and get through this mess.

:chicken: :Drink:


Tough Alaskan? Sure, Ill take it.
But really I am just a freedom loving sloth that wants to go boating.
Next time I want to respond to something, I'll run the post past you first to make sure no feelings are hurt. (i'd say that to your face also)
Just calm down. No one has their feelers hurt but you apparently.
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Re: martial law

Postby Ahusk » Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:10 pm

smitty wrote:
Ahusk wrote:
What if an individual with covid was the person that used the bathroom right before you and coughed all over the thing? There is only so much cleaning you can do.



Do you still buy fuel? Do you still buy groceries? Are fuel pumps and grocery stores not in the same category as a restroom at a boat launch?


I have to buy groceries once a week regardless. Doesn't matter if I consume them at home or on a river. I pump my own gas and immediately hand sanitizer afterwards. I am no medical professional but I can pretty much assure you the chances of getting sick off a outdoor gas pump are tiny compared to an enclosed public restroom.
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Re: martial law

Postby Ahusk » Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:14 pm

mtncntrykid wrote:We are in the throws of a worldwide pandemic crisis with no confirmed means to control. There are guidelines being put in place by leaders, at suggestion of scientific experts. People have no means to control this situation and the only way they can contribute to help themselves and others in the world is to unselfishly change their way of life by following these guidelines as closely as possible to prevent suffering or death to themselves and others.
Personally, I don't consider this giving up but a far stronger human being than the one who considers only his own wants and needs.

Jetcrafter,
Thank You for seeing the true meaning in my posts!

I have said my peace and will dis-continue this conversation in respect of the other members on this great site.


My condolences and very well said. I agree completely.
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Re: martial law

Postby mtncntrykid » Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:42 am

Ahusk wrote: I pump my own gas and immediately hand sanitizer afterwards. I am no medical professional but I can pretty much assure you the chances of getting sick off a outdoor gas pump are tiny compared to an enclosed public restroom.

Respectfully....
I appreciate your love for getting outdoors and doing what you do so here is something to consider on your adventures.....
They have determined that this virus remains contagious on metal surfaces for up to 3 days. If you are a carrier and touch that pump handle, how many people could you infect in those three days. Some people can be carriers without any symptoms. Cardboard holds live virus for over 24 hours as well as paper. They are now considering the possibility of transmission being through all of these potential sources. In my area they are suggesting to retrieve your mail and packages with rubber gloves and leave said mail in a safe place like the garage for three days before handling it. And it is good to disinfect your hands after pumping gas but that doesn't clean the pump. (just saying - good step to protect yourself)
Just suggesting to think more about how we can all work together as a team to stop this thing as quick as possible and save as many lives that might be lost if we don't. My dad used to tell me when he was teaching me to play ball, "it's a team sport and you can't win if you don't play as a team". He also used to tell me that if "I'm not a part of the solution I am part of the problem".
I think both of these could apply. Definitely don't want to be part of the problem in this case.
If your in an area that isn't really being affected yet, don't be lulled into a false security. It will get there given time and you need to get your defenses up before it does or lives will be lost. Please take this seriously!
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Re: martial law

Postby Riverjohn » Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:42 am

mtncntrykid wrote:
Ahusk wrote: I pump my own gas and immediately hand sanitizer afterwards. I am no medical professional but I can pretty much assure you the chances of getting sick off a outdoor gas pump are tiny compared to an enclosed public restroom.

Respectfully....
I appreciate your love for getting outdoors and doing what you do so here is something to consider on your adventures.....
They have determined that this virus remains contagious on metal surfaces for up to 3 days. If you are a carrier and touch that pump handle, how many people could you infect in those three days. Some people can be carriers without any symptoms. Cardboard holds live virus for over 24 hours as well as paper. They are now considering the possibility of transmission being through all of these potential sources. In my area they are suggesting to retrieve your mail and packages with rubber gloves and leave said mail in a safe place like the garage for three days before handling it. And it is good to disinfect your hands after pumping gas but that doesn't clean the pump. (just saying - good step to protect yourself)
Just suggesting to think more about how we can all work together as a team to stop this thing as quick as possible and save as many lives that might be lost if we don't. My dad used to tell me when he was teaching me to play ball, "it's a team sport and you can't win if you don't play as a team". He also used to tell me that if "I'm not a part of the solution I am part of the problem".
I think both of these could apply. Definitely don't want to be part of the problem in this case.
If your in an area that isn't really being affected yet, don't be lulled into a false security. It will get there given time and you need to get your defenses up before it does or lives will be lost. Please take this seriously!

Respectfully also. Fred Meyer here in Oregon is sanitizing the pump nozzle and the keys after every use. I carry hand sanitizer in my truck which I use before I get out and after I get back in. I assume that I could have the virus and everyone else has it so if I do encounter someone I stay way away from them and also turn my head away from them. I am also going to start wearing a bandanna around my neck so I can just pull it up when needed (Like an Old Western Bank Robber). I personally think they went too far with this. We will see. Stay Safe.
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Re: martial law

Postby Skirulefool » Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:37 am

Doing a little social distancing today
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Re: martial law

Postby lovetheedge » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:44 pm

I am writing this not in hopes of changing one persons mind who seem completely set, but in hopes of limiting his thinking from influencing others to do the same. One person going on the river when no one else is there or will be there is of no consequence, but many people doing so is a concern. If we had the club runs up the salmon river there would have been probably 50 people there at once. All launching and landing at the same Time. Camping in close proximity, sharing dinner and drinks around the campfire. People would be arriving from all over the state and out of state. A prescription for disaster.

Here in Idaho an epicenter of the virus is in Blaine County, home of the Sun Valley ski resort. The virus was brought there by out of area visitors on a ski vacation. The population of the city of Sun Valley is 1428 people. The county has about 22,000 people. Pretty rural and spread out like where much of where our river running occurs.
A New Yorker magazine article put the situation there this way, "Nearly seven hundred Brotherhood members had made the journey from their homes across the United States, or in some cases from London, for their forty-seventh annual mountain meet-up. By the following week, upward of a hundred and twenty-six members of the Brotherhood had come down with symptoms of the coronavirus." "The county’s infection rate is now the highest in the nation—greater even than those of New York’s Westchester and Rockland counties". The numbers of people with the disease counted in Blaine county do not include out of town visitors, only residents who get the disease are counted in that county. If a visitor, like the 126 visitors, comes down with the disease there, those counts goes to their home location. So the numbers don't tell the whole story as to the extent of the disease there by any means.
"Idaho’s doctors and nurses face the greatest danger. More than fifty health-care workers have tested positive in the state’s South Central Health District, about forty of whom work for the St. Luke’s hospital system in Blaine County."
Our ski resorts closed down voluntarily prior to the governors order. The spring breakers were coming here from states that had lock down orders in place. Selfish inconsiderate people for sure.

This disease spreads fast. If you don't have it your area, be thankful, but it only takes one person to start the spread the virus.

This is not about one persons freedom. Most laws we have limit peoples freedom for the protection of others. For example drunk driving protects people from getting killed by someone doing what he wants to do and to hell with the impact on others. Staying at home protects everyone from the acts of others, which requires a limit on everyone's freedom. I don't care if the ones not following the guidelines get sick, that is their own fault.Just stay out of our hospitals so you don't infect our doctors and nurses. But when they have the disease and spread germs for up to 2 weeks, when they mostly have no symptoms, that's another thing. In the beginning a person has no way of knowing if they have it to spread or not.

Idaho is a state full of independent thinking people who hate government intervention and the like. But people from here for the most part are cooperating. I live in a county of 11,000 people yet so many of the cars we see on the road and in store parking lots are from out of state or from other counties. Our one case was from someone who traveled out of the county. With only 11 beds in our 2 hospitals equipped for the virus we really don't want it coming here. Over half the people in my zip code are age 55 and over.

The businesses here are going beyond the guidelines. The pharmacy and others do not allow customers in the store, items are brought to them at the door. The grocery store has limited hours for high risk people to shop. They limit the amount people can buy, an out-of-towner came in and bought all the diapers in the store, that was the end of that. Another selfish act with a to hell with others attitude. The auto repair shop is open only two days a week. Most restaurants closed when they did not need to. I am grateful to them all.
With the full cooperation of everyone we will beat this.
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Re: martial law

Postby Riverjohn » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:49 pm

lovetheedge wrote:I am writing this not in hopes of changing one persons mind who seem completely set, but in hopes of limiting his thinking from influencing others to do the same. One person going on the river when no one else is there or will be there is of no consequence, but many people doing so is a concern. If we had the club runs up the salmon river there would have been probably 50 people there at once. All launching and landing at the same Time. Camping in close proximity, sharing dinner and drinks around the campfire. People would be arriving from all over the state and out of state. A prescription for disaster.

Here in Idaho an epicenter of the virus is in Blaine County, home of the Sun Valley ski resort. The virus was brought there by out of area visitors on a ski vacation. The population of the city of Sun Valley is 1428 people. The county has about 22,000 people. Pretty rural and spread out like where much of where our river running occurs.
A New Yorker magazine article put the situation there this way, "Nearly seven hundred Brotherhood members had made the journey from their homes across the United States, or in some cases from London, for their forty-seventh annual mountain meet-up. By the following week, upward of a hundred and twenty-six members of the Brotherhood had come down with symptoms of the coronavirus." "The county’s infection rate is now the highest in the nation—greater even than those of New York’s Westchester and Rockland counties". The numbers of people with the disease counted in Blaine county do not include out of town visitors, only residents who get the disease are counted in that county. If a visitor, like the 126 visitors, comes down with the disease there, those counts goes to their home location. So the numbers don't tell the whole story as to the extent of the disease there by any means.
"Idaho’s doctors and nurses face the greatest danger. More than fifty health-care workers have tested positive in the state’s South Central Health District, about forty of whom work for the St. Luke’s hospital system in Blaine County."
Our ski resorts closed down voluntarily prior to the governors order. The spring breakers were coming here from states that had lock down orders in place. Selfish inconsiderate people for sure.




This disease spreads fast. If you don't have it your area, be thankful, but it only takes one person to start the spread the virus.

This is not about one persons freedom. Most laws we have limit peoples freedom for the protection of others. For example drunk driving protects people from getting killed by someone doing what he wants to do and to hell with the impact on others. Staying at home protects everyone from the acts of others, which requires a limit on everyone's freedom. I don't care if the ones not following the guidelines get sick, that is their own fault.Just stay out of our hospitals so you don't infect our doctors and nurses. But when they have the disease and spread germs for up to 2 weeks, when they mostly have no symptoms, that's another thing. In the beginning a person has no way of knowing if they have it to spread or not.

Idaho is a state full of independent thinking people who hate government intervention and the like. But people from here for the most part are cooperating. I live in a county of 11,000 people yet so many of the cars we see on the road and in store parking lots are from out of state or from other counties. Our one case was from someone who traveled out of the county. With only 11 beds in our 2 hospitals equipped for the virus we really don't want it coming here. Over half the people in my zip code are age 55 and over.

The businesses here are going beyond the guidelines. The pharmacy and others do not allow customers in the store, items are brought to them at the door. The grocery store has limited hours for high risk people to shop. They limit the amount people can buy, an out-of-towner came in and bought all the diapers in the store, that was the end of that. Another selfish act with a to hell with others attitude. The auto repair shop is open only two days a week. Most restaurants closed when they did not need to. I am grateful to them all.
With the full cooperation of everyone we will beat this.


Apples And Oranges!
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Re: martial law

Postby viking » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:58 pm

Discord arises from the definitions of "appropriate" and "necessary", the implied lines being drawn, and the arbitrary inconsistency of these lines. For example, it is appropriate to buy food at the MacDonald's drive through, but it is not appropriate to use a boat ramp. Clearly, if there is nobody else at the ramp, then its use is perfectly acceptable and appropriate. Therefore I will use an uncrowded boat ramp. So far as I am aware, the only way a MacDonald's drive through is acceptable (to me) is if all MacDonald's employees are wearing respirators. They may be wearing face masks, but I am not aware that they are wearing respirators. Therefore, the MacDonald's drive through is not acceptable or appropriate, and I will not use it.

If I run out of food, then it is appropriate and necessary that I drive to the grocery store. Except not really. Instead, I can stop eating (fast), thereby reducing the risk to myself and others. With appropriate vitamin supplementation ordered from Amazon, most Americans could fast for months and be far healthier at the end than at the beginning. So is it truly appropriate and necessary that I drive to the grocery store? No. However, no government authority is suggesting this (so far as I am aware). At an even higher level of self-sacrifice, if I become critically ill with COVID19, then I should remain home and not seek medical attention; after all, if I drive to the hospital I will be putting others at risk, and who am I to put my life above theirs?

There will be some contention about where best to draw the line(s). In the limit, everyone on the planet stays home for a month, regardless of circumstances. This will actually end the disease (unless transmitted via animals), and it can be argued that anything less is wishful thinking.

Personally, I ask Odin for advice. Gotta test my "improved" steering setup, and maybe my muffler-less noise suppression system. And the new light bar.
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